Moments of Permanence - Because I need to think about things that are differently stressful, sometimes...

From: james_davis_nicoll Date: May 9th, 2009 04:34 pm (UTC) (Link)

Oddly, I've read secondary world fantasies that have Gyspies, despite the notable limitation of not having an India for them to have come from.

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From: morgan_dhu Date: May 9th, 2009 08:42 pm (UTC) (Link)

Jacqueline Carey, in the Kushiel series, is the only fantasy writer I can think of off-hand who has analogue peoples for both Roma and Jews.

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From: dhobikikutti Date: May 9th, 2009 08:53 pm (UTC) (Link)

And Guy Gavriel Kay who deals explicitly with the interactions of the Kindath (Jews), and the Asharites (Muslims).

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From: naraht Date: May 9th, 2009 11:50 pm (UTC) (Link)

Guy Gavriel Kay is sounding more and more interesting. I've been meaning to read him anyway because of his books about Byzantium (my family and religious history).

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From: dhobikikutti Date: May 9th, 2009 11:59 pm (UTC) (Link)

I loved his Sarantine Mosaic although I've heard many complaints from people both in terms of gender, and in terms of 'he just stole everything from history books'.

I also have an utter and unholy love for his 'Lions of Al-Rassan', which again, has been criticised.
I am too biased to care, but I acknowledge the opposing view points for the record. :)

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From: elspethdixon Date: May 11th, 2009 06:21 pm (UTC) (Link)

in terms of 'he just stole everything from history books'.


I would be interested to hear what these people think of straight historical fiction, then -- the similarities/parallels to European and Middle eastern history were one of the things I really liked about the Sarantine Mosaic and Last Light of the Sun.

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From: holyschist Date: May 11th, 2009 12:30 am (UTC) (Link)

I love Kay like burning, and I think he handles female characters fine. And I love how he's taken history to make a fantasy world that seems utterly real and rich but which is recognizably not our own (it's hard than it looks).

On the other hand, I really didn't like his straight fantasy novels. But Saratine Mosaic (Byzantine) books are gorgeous, and so is Al-Rassan and The Last Light of the Sun. I still haven't read Tigana or A Song for Arbonne (I really should--I was saving them to spread out, but it's been a couple years).

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From: sqbr Date: May 10th, 2009 01:22 am (UTC) (Link)

Yes, I think it's interesting how much more common they are.

Roma (apparently "gypsies" is an offensive term) are I think a bigger part of the typical vision of the Romantic Past. They turn up in folk tales and period fiction a lot more than jews. Of course the stereotypes about them are just as harmful and untrue, and as you point out very disconnected from their actual history but they're more "fun" to play with :/ Also I think people are more aware of the fact that european jews experienced constant attempts at genocide so are more self conscious about replicating anti-semitic stereotypes. The more I learn about the actual history and experiences of the Roma (and I don't know much) the more skeeved I am by stuff like "Evil Gypsy Curses".

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From: lady_ganesh Date: May 12th, 2009 11:58 am (UTC) (Link)

And they're a very insular people, which I think makes it easier to tell stories about them that may or may not be true. (Agreed on the actual history making everything skeevier and more uncomfortable.)

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